【09.11 17 NPR】中国百姓期待的是奥巴马的实际行动，而非口头支票（评论见沙发，20#更新）
本帖最后由 vivicat 于 2009-11-29 02:10 编辑【中文标题】中国百姓期待的是奥巴马的实际行动，而非口头支票
【原文标题】Ordinary Chinese Wait For Obama's Deeds, Not Words
【登载媒体】NPR
【来源地址】http://ww.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=120488554
【译者】vivicat
【翻译方式】人工
【声明】本翻译供Anti-CNN使用，未经AC或译者许可，不得转载。
【原文库链接】http://bbs.m4.cn/forum.php?mod=viewthread&tid=208401&extra=page%3D1
【译文】
Before the summit in Beijing on Tuesday, President Obama had met several times with his Chinese counterpart, Hu Jintao. But making his first presidential trip to Asia, this is Obama's first contact with people in China, and he did not receive the rock star reception that has greeted him in other regions such as Europe.
在周二前往北京进行首脑会谈之前，奥巴马总统就已与胡景涛主席多次会面。而在他首次出访亚洲的行程中，奥巴马是首次与中国民众接触，且他并未受到如同在欧洲等其他地区摇滚明星般的接待。
One of Obama's main messages has been that the U.S. does not seek to contain China or force its values on it.
奥巴马此行所要表达的主要信息是美国不会遏制中国（的发展），也不会将自己的价值观强加于中国。
Many Chinese welcome that message, but they don't necessarily trust it.
许多中国人欢迎这种论调，但是他们并不完全相信。
"This humility is a kind of pose," says Yu Baoping, a Beijing resident. "Of course, as America's president, he's got to protect America's interests, and I suspect that could harm China's interests. For example, he's slapped high duties on imports from China, and this has had a big impact on us."
“这种谦逊更像是种姿态”北京市民于保平（音译）说道。“诚然，作为美国总统他需要去保护美国的利益，并且我认为这会伤害到中国的利益。举个例子，其对中国进口商品收取的高关税就对我们影响极大。”
Beijing-based blogger Rao Jin acknowledges that Obama is charismatic. But he sees little difference between Obama's China policies and those of his predecessor. Many American analysts see President Bush's China policies as relatively successful and advocated that Obama continue them. But not Rao.
来自北京的博主饶谨认为奥巴马是具有魅力的。同时他也看到了奥巴马的对华政策与其前任没有不同。许多美国分析家都认为布什总统的对华政策是比较成功的，并主张让奥巴马总统延续该类政策。但饶谨并不这么认为。
"Chinese peoples' opinion of him will only change when he does things that bring substantial benefits to U.S.-China relations, such as refusing to meet with the Dalai Lama, stop taking protectionist trade measures and stop selling arms to separatist forces such as Taiwan."
中国民众只有在奥巴马做出一些确实为中美关系带来利益的事情——如拒绝会见达赖，停止贸易保护政策并停止向如台湾之类的分裂分子出售武器——的时候，才会转变他们对其的看法。
Last year, Rao founded Anti-CNN, a Web site devoted to exposing perceived bias in Western media reports about China.
去年，饶谨创办了反CNN网站，这是一个旨在揭露他们所认为的西方媒体对于中国的具有偏见的报道。
The U.S. Embassy in Beijing had invited Rao to blog Monday's town-hall discussion in Shanghai, but Chinese organizers had already picked the audience, and Rao didn't get in.
位于北京的美国大使馆邀请了饶谨参加周一在上海市政厅举行的博主讨论会，但中方的组织者早已选好了观众，饶谨不在其内。
The U.S. also had pressed to have the discussion broadcast live, but Chinese officials declined. It was only broadcast live in Shanghai, thus limiting the reach of Obama's message. On Chinese Web portals, censors deleted parts of the discussion that dealt with Internet censorship.
美方同样有要求将讨论会进行直播，但中方官员拒绝了。这场讨论会只在上海进行直播，这也限制了奥巴马讲话的传达。在中国的门户网站上，网监依照审查制度删除了部分讨论（实况）。
Rao argues that Obama's use of the Internet has won him many online fans in China. But, he says, he has also created unrealistic expectations of a more friendly United States.
饶谨认为奥巴马使用互联网使其赢得了许多中国的在线粉丝。但他说，奥巴马同时也创造了一个不切实际的更友善的美国。
"When these fans discover that he can't make good on his promises, the mood on the Internet could coalesce very quickly and turn into a force against him."
“但这些粉丝发现奥巴马无法达成他的承诺时，互联网上的支持声就会立刻倒戈。”
An online survey by the Global Times showed that 86 percent of respondents were indifferent to Obama's visit, while 46 percent said they disliked the U.S. president. The Global Times is known as a nationalist tabloid, but the poll still suggests a big change since the end of last year, when an online poll by the China Daily found 75 percent support for Obama.
环球时报的一项在线调查显示，86%的居民对奥巴马的来访不关心，同时有46%的人表示不喜欢美国总统。环球时报被人做是一份民族主义小报，该调查还显示相比去年底中国日报的在线调查结果——奥巴马有75%的支持率——是有很大变化的。
Other Chinese had hoped that Obama would raise the human rights issue more forcefully with the Chinese government.
其它一些中国人希望奥巴马能就人权问题向中国政府施加压力。
"I can't say that I don't feel any sense of loss," says Pu Zhiqiang, a Beijing-based civil rights lawyer. "Over the past decade, I've had to convince myself not to hope that external forces can change China."
“不能说我一点都不觉得失落，”北京的维权律师浦志强说道，“在过去10年间，我不得不说服自己不要期望外力能够改变中国。”
Pu is particularly critical of the highly staged town hall events.
浦志强严厉地批评了这种已事先高度排练过的政府项目。
"This kind of event does not represent the thinking of China's youth. It's the same as previous visits to China by American presidents," Pu says. "This sort of rehearsed performance is disrespectful to our guests and deceitful towards our own people."
“这种活动并未尊重中国年轻人的想法。这与前几次美国总统访华无二，”浦志强说道。“这种排练是对于嘉宾和自己人民的欺骗。”
Pu notes that U.S. Presidents George W. Bush and Bill Clinton visited Beijing's top universities in 2002 and 1998 respectively, and held discussions with students.
浦志强指出，美国总统哦乔治布什和比尔克林顿在2002和1998年访问北京顶级学府时都与学生有过讨论。
While Clinton and then-President Jiang Zemin fielded questions from reporters in 1998, Obama and Hu each made statements to the press Tuesday, but took no questions.
当是克林顿与时任国家主席的江泽民同志与1998年回答过（学生的）问题，奥巴马和胡锦涛周二都发表了讲话，但未回答任何问题。
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翻译仓促，请大家多拍砖
评论
本帖最后由 vivicat 于 2009-11-29 02:00 编辑John Gee (Quixoter) wrote:
"...things that bring substantial benefits to U.S.-China relations, such as refusing to meet with the Dalai Lama, stop taking protectionist trade measures and stop selling arms to separatist forces such as Taiwan."
Sounds like a pretty one-sided relations-ship to me.
2009年11月17日 9:48:38
John Gee (Quixoter)写道：
“确实为中美关系带来利益的事情——如拒绝会见达赖，停止贸易保护政策并停止向如台湾之类的分裂分子出售武器”
这在我听来像是颇像是种片面关系。
2009年11月17日 9:48:38
Joe Shuren (joeshuren) wrote:
Mr Obama didn't really answer a single question, and his talk about American history failed to make a connection with needs of Chinese to understand their own history (hint: diversity is not a big concern, maybe a luxury brand). But you have to chuckle when Mr Obama lectures these young business students (Young Communists) about the need to be social entrepreneurs instead of selfishly trying to get rich.
2009年11月17日 9:57:00
Joe Shuren (joeshuren)写道：
奥巴马先生并未真正回答了任一问题，且他那关于美国历史的谈话未能迎合中国人了解他们历史的需要（提示：多样性不是问题，但或许是个奢侈品）。而当奥巴马先生为这些年轻的商学院学生（年轻的共产党员）做关于“成为社会企业家的需要”而非“如何自私的变富”的报告时，你又不得不发笑。
2009年11月17日 9:57:00
Mark Pachankis (KarlPopperFan) wrote:
the tariff on tires only hurts poor American consumers and Chinese workers while protecting a VERY small portion of the US population. This is what tariffs do: protect a few at the expense of the majority.
A tariff on tired imported from China will raise the price of low-end tires, which means poor people may drive longer on worn down tires, which endangers their lives and the lives on other on the road.
Way to go, Obama! Way to ignore economic history that shows that tariffs do NOT work!
2009年11月17日 10:19:22
Mark Pachankis (KarlPopperFan)写道：
轮胎税在仅保护一小部分美国人利益的同时会伤害到贫穷的美国顾客和中国工人。这就是税收所做的事情：牺牲大部分人（的利益）以保护那一小部分人。
对从中国进口的轮胎征税将会抬高低档次轮胎的售价，而这就意味着穷人会加长已磨损轮胎的使用时间，这对于他们自身及路人来说都是极其危险的。
干得好，奥巴马！继续忽视经济史告诉我们的道理——关税不起任何作用——吧！
2009年11月17日 10:19:22
Richard Kadas (imgleader) wrote:
The impression of the ordinary Chinese on Obama seems quite accurate. Our experience with him as Americans has shown that he values the adulation he receives as a 'Rock Star' president more than he does gratification that comes from actual accomplishment.
He will go down in history as the president who said, "We can", but couldn't focus enough to make change happen. A man of too many words and too few deeds
2009年11月17日 10:22:52
Richard Kadas (imgleader)写道：
中国民众对奥巴马的看法似乎是相当准确。我们美国人的经验告诉我们，相对凭借实际成绩而获得的赞许，他更看重那如“摇滚明星“般的奉承。
作为一位提出“我们可以”的总统，他将会被载入史册，但不用对改变的出现抱有太大希望。他的口头承诺远多于实际行动。
2009年11月17日 10:22:52
Usurpers Dream (article1section9) wrote:
I wouldn't hold my breath China. We in the US are still waiting too.
2009年11月17日 11:16:29
Usurpers Dream (article1section9) 写道:
中国，我不会屏住我的呼吸。我们美国人也在等待。
2009年11月17日 11:16:29 抢板凳 抢地板！ 我...我只是打酱油的... 打酱油。 位于北京的美国大使馆邀请了饶谨参加周一在上海市政厅举行的博主讨论会，但中方的组织者早已选好了观众，饶谨不在其内。
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明明是美国方面事先就请上海学生去喝咖啡了，却要怪中方的组织者早已选好了观众，西霉颠倒黑白的作风没有改变。中方的组织者本意是避免奥巴马的尴尬，无奈好心被当成驴肝肺，里外不是人 感谢楼主的辛勤劳动。谢谢。 本帖最后由 遥远的冬天 于 2009-11-27 10:01 编辑
But he sees little difference between Obama's China policies and those of his predecessor.
同时他也看到了奥巴马的对华政策与其前任有些不同。
应该是说没有看到不同吧。
胡景涛——胡锦涛。 But he sees little difference between Obama's China policies and those of his predecessor.
同时他也看到了奥巴马的对华政策与其前任有些不同。
应该是说没有看到不同吧。
胡景涛——胡锦涛。 ...
遥远的冬天 发表于 2009-11-27 09:59 http://bbs.m4.cn/images/common/back.gif
额。。。是的。。。little是指没有。。。我搞错了。。多谢～～ 不错,有评论.很好~ 这就叫贼喊捉贼 浦志强之流只是民族的败类而已，不管什么事情我们自己都能解决，靠西方国家，到最后只能是饮鸠止渴而已。 环球时报的一项在线调查显示，86%的居民对奥巴马的来访不关心，同时有46%的人表示不喜欢美国总统
人家奥巴马又不是什么救世主，不关心很正常 没抢到前排……后排围观 善良的回帖，只是为了尊重楼主的勤劳与热情！强烈关注西方人的实际行动。 支持LZ的翻译 每次看到有网友翻译外文文章都万分感激，因为我自己知道做这份劳动是很辛苦的，再次感谢楼主！ 貌似美国国家公共电台对站长有点关注
评论
本帖最后由 vivicat 于 2009-11-29 02:10 编辑Santa Rita Hunter (Santaritahunter) wrote:
"Chinese peoples' opinion of him will only change when he does things that bring substantial benefits to U.S.-China relations, such as refusing to meet with the Dalai Lama, stop taking protectionist trade measures and stop selling arms to separatist forces such as Taiwan."
In other words we need to kiss the emperor's rear end. No citizen of China has any right, business or intellectual merit in accusing the US of being protectionist, of selling arms to the wrong people, or of meeting with the wrong people. China can FOAD. If that blogger's attitude is typical, then no one in America needs China for anything.
2009年11月17日 12:04:01
Tarriffs DO work if they're accompanied by immediate measures to stimulate replacement of the international tarriffed source with a domestic production source. Smoot Hawley was only a failure for the USA. It allowed Italy and other European states to insource production that they'd formerly acquired from the USA because of their trade retaliation. Smoot Hawley failed for the USA because at the time the USA was a huge net exporter with a massive current accounts surplus. If done now, especially as applied to China, something like Smoot Hawley would make things better for the USA, because we are a net importer with a massive trade deficit.
Modern neoclassical macroeconomic theory has never developed any kind of way of assessing the market effects of a huge, centralized, non-capitalist, state controlled economy on the international markets. People who are pushing for "free trade" with China are engaging in delusional faith based reasoning. China is not an open market and never will be. The Chinese domestic economy will NEVER be subject to market forces as long as they have a state run command economy.
We should cut all ties with China and expand ties with nations that are more open to US goods.
2009年11月17日 12:15:15
Santa Rita Hunter (Santaritahunter)写道:
“中国民众只有在奥巴马做出一些确实为中美关系带来利益的事情——如拒绝会见达赖，停止贸易保护政策并停止向如台湾之类的分裂分子出售武器——的时候，才会转变他们对其的看法。”
用另一句话来讲就是我们应当去亲吻皇帝的屁股。中国的民众没有任何人有权利、义务或是学术价值来指责美国贸易保护、接见或是销售武器给错误的人。中国可以去死了。如果该博主所表达的是中典型态度的话，那美国也不再需要中国了。
2009年11月17日 12:04:01
只要有配套措施来刺激国内生产代替被课税的国外产品的话，关税确实是有效的。斯姆特-霍利对美国来说仅是一个失败。出于贸易报复，意大利及其他欧洲国家可以对原本从美国采购的产品进行内包。对美国而言斯姆特-霍利会失败，是因为当时美国是一个有着庞大经常账户盈余（也就是贸易顺差）的大型净出口国。如果是今天来做的话，尤其像应用于中国身上的话，诸如斯姆特-霍利之类的（法案）或许倒能为美国带来好处，因为我们现在是一个庞大的贸易赤字净进口国。
现代新古典宏观经济理论从来未研究出评估一个巨大而集中且由国家控制的非资本主义的经济体进入国际市场的效应的方法。那些想要推动与中国“自由贸易”的人纯粹是在妄想。中国现在不是将来也不会是一个开放的市场。只要中国仍是国家掌控经济，其国内经济就永远不会是市场关注的重心。
我们应当切断于中国的联系，而与其他市场更为开放的国家开展贸易。
2009年11月17日 12:15:15
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未完待续
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