Oh Great! Now we should start a war with our own banker? Sure! As if we had the money, the military readiness, and the will to attack a huge nuclear armed country when we have been unsuccessfully trying for 10 years to defeat a bunch of goat herders.
Rudd can round up his own military and go for it, if he wants to. Oh! right! he is no longer Prime Minister.
How to deal toughly with your banker ? Rebuild the US economy and quit shipping quality middle class jobs overseas. And then pay off the loan.
It is true politics is dirty. You can not trust a politician on their face-value.
Tell Rudd that the US is broke, busted up, tired and in no mood or condition for another fight, especially not with China. So if he's a real man and a real leader, he'll use his own force and the force of his own country to achieve his agenda instead of begging for someone else to do his work. Use force with China? Easy to say, not easy to do. I can tell my neighbor he should fight Tyson but he's smart enough to tell me to fight him myself. YOU use force with China and tell us how that went.
No wonder this guy can only be a Minister for Foreign Affairs instead of being staying as a prime minister. I wonder how long he can stay as the Minister for Foreign Affairs with such kind of evil intent.
US and Australia are a threat to China.
I got a flyer in the mail for a Christmas sale at a hardware store. Not a single item in it, was made in America. Most likely, any item in the 8 pages was made in China. Ok, America is finished. Got it people? The jobs are gone. There is nothing left but welfare for Americans. Borrow money from China, and give out those food stamps Obama. Woo Hoo! America, such a great nation. Can't even make a screwdriver now.
world politics is dirty as hell especially the US and its allies who are the most evil of them all
doesnt this say a lot about australian intelligence,or more to the point how little of it they have.
that idiot wanted america to be prepared to use force on china, he belongs in an asylum, the mans a complete looney,
china would be preparing their dinner after leaving the whole of the u.s. smoking like a massive barbeque. i suppose we couldnt expect anything better from the prime minister of a huge holiday resort.
George W and the Republicans sold the U.S. to China a long time ago. We already lost that war.
The GOP cares nothing for democracy, God, the USA, or you. They are corporate tools, lining their own pockets. They lie and cheat and send young Americans to their death solely for their own profit. They hide behind @#$% patriotism and hypocritical religious posturing (Jesus was all about love and charity-the opposite of republican practice) to advance their greedy destruction of democracy. They have cut education over and over and over until the average U.S. citizen is stupid enough to believe their lies.
this is looking down on asians as inferior to western peoples this guy should apologize .
If Rudd wants war, Australia can wage it and be sure to remind him that all the young men in his family need to be front line soldiers. If the thought of his son Nicholas, shooting off against People's Liberation Army soldiers unnerves him, perhaps he should advocate peace instead.
It looks like the world doesn't like US but secretly use US to do their dirty work or start a cause.
it's time for China to occupy australia and enslave its people.
This is hilarious, we can't even financial continue the war in Afghanistan and Iraq, how on earth do people expect us to afford a confrontation with China? Oh yeah I forgot, we can ask the Chinese to buy some of US bonds to finance our war against them and maybe while were at war, they could possibly forgive our payments on the loans until after the war. That should work. Boy are we (US) dumb or what?
http://www.sbs.com.au/news/article/1433401/Be-ready-to-act-on-China,-Rudd-told-US
Rudd may not have been able to get anything completed as PM, but this does not mean his take and stance on China was wrong!!! IN fact he was and is dead right!!! Prepare for Free Asia to ACT on No Korean and China if and when the time comes! USA-JAPAN-TAIWAN-REP of KOREA-THAILAND-AUSTRALIA!!!! Defend Liberty/Freedom/Independence/DEMOCRACY!!!!
China is already a threat though. They have flexed some muscle not long ago with their rare earth economic monopoly. Their military capability is not as big as the US but China will get to a point where the US and the world will become very intimidated. If anything WW3 will involve China one way or another. Taiwan, South Korea and Japan will be the first to fall. It got to this stage because of cheap Chinese labour that took away the manufacturing industries of so many countries. Very grim.
WikiLeaks is providing us a report card on our leaders; the very people that we employ to do a job! Let’s thank WikiLeaks for providing us these report cards free or charge.
TBC
====================================================================================
应给我们建议中“文子”同学的要求翻译《悉尼先驱早报》的评论，正文差不多，就不翻了，这么迟才贴出来，不好意思啊。
【原文标题】： Rudd meets a brutal reality
【中文标题】：陆克文的窘境
【翻译作者】康康 Tainy
【原贴地址】： http://www.smh.com.au/opinion/politics/rudd-meets-a-brutal-reality-20101207-18oaz.html?comments=51#comments
【发布日期】： 2010.12.08
【翻译截止日期】： 2010.12.08
【翻译评论数 / 总评论数】： 24/51
China is owned and run by a totalitarian oligarchy interested in nothing but it's own survival and advancement. The fact that the country now makes things cheap for western consumers changes nothing. The close connection between the ambitions of so-called Chinese commercial interests and Australia's resources should be of national concern.
SteveH. - December 08, 2010, 7:13AM
中国被集权主义的寡头们控制，这些寡头只关心他们自己的生存和发展，即使中国现在为西方消费者制造出低价消费品也不能改变以上事实。国家应该关注中国所谓商业利益野心和澳大利亚资源之间的紧密关系。
Rudds wikileaks "revelations" are only shocking, surprising and scathing if u have no idea of the world around us...pick up a history book and u may be shocked even further!!!
Rob | ACT - December 08, 2010, 7:14AM
只有对我们周围的世界一无所知的人才会觉得维基泄密中陆克文的“解密”让人震惊，错愕和抓狂。找本历史书看看，那才叫震惊呢。
Eastern philosophical approaches are pretty much a closed book to western minds accustomed to a relatively crash through or crash approach. Those western approaches have been developed and consolidated during a period of unquestioned western hegemony and are not calibrated to deal with the gradual disappearance of that hegemonic power. The Chinese, in contrast, coming from a position of past relative weakness, and having learned much from thinkers like Sun Tzu, have a far more subtle and hard to anticipate approach. The West must learn to be far more subtle themselves if we are to cope with the emerging diplomatic realities of the Twenty First Century.
lesm | Balmain - December 08, 2010, 7:24AM
对西方式的思维来说东方式的哲学方法就是一本打不开的书（难解之谜），西方式的思维被认为是相对来说更具思辨性。毫无疑问，西方的（思维）方式形成于西方掌握霸权的时代，他们对这种霸权的逐步消亡还没有做好准备。相对来说中国的思维方式受过去较弱势的地位影响，吸取了很多类似孙子之类思想家的智慧，所以在对未来的预测方面比西方更加复杂微妙。如果西方要应对21 世纪的外交新形势就应该好好学习这种东方式的复杂微妙的思想。
When will people like Rudd understand the true threat in the big picture?
The US provokes most of the conflicts it is involved in. China is run by an oligarchical dictatorship. Their goal is to preserve their own power. Just like the USSR last century, the Chinese "Imperialist threat" is grossly exaggerated.
We should demand that our government follow the path of Jefferson's
statesmenship from 1799:
"I am for free commerce with all nations, political connection with none, and little or no diplomatic establishment.
And I am not for linking ourselves by new treaties with the quarrels of Europe, entering that field of slaughter to preserve their balance, or joining in the confederacy of Kings to war against the principles of liberty."
alfredC - December 08, 2010, 7:30AM
像陆克文那样的人什么时候才能我们面对的世界格局？大部分美国卷入的冲突都是美国自己挑起的，而寡头独裁者统治的中国只是想保持住他们的实力，就像上世纪的苏联一样，中国的“帝国主义威胁”只是夸大其词。我们应该要求政府遵循1799 年杰弗逊的原则：
“我赞成与各国的自由贸易，但政治来往没有必要，与各国的外交关系点到即可。
我不赞成以条约的形式将我们与欧洲加以联系，也不赞成加入战场保持它们之间的平衡，更不赞成加入邦联进而进行反自由的战争。”
My experience and experiences I have heard from others is that the Chinese, as communists or capitalists were open and direct, We always regarded them as talented and capable, we gave our word and we respected their word. This showed in our communication. Try that for a change instead of wandering around like a bull in a china shop. They know their arsenal is obsolete before it comes off the production line so don't get all fussed up about their military.
peteg3 | Sydney - December 08, 2010, 7:32AM
我和我听到的经验都告诉我，无论是共产主义者还是资本主义者，中国人都开放而直爽，他们是有天分有能力的人，我们信任他们也尊重他们的承诺，这些都能在与他们交往中得到验证。试着去了解他们而不是像头中国店里的牛一样绕着他们转。要知道他们的武器在下生产线以前就已经过时了，所以别对他们的军队大惊小怪了。
I thought the favor was already repaid with the unexpected Australian lobster ban into China last week. Well this is much more than lobsters than......
Lalu | India - December 08, 2010, 7:33AM
我以为中国上周已经用出乎意料的龙虾禁运报答了我们。虽然他们的报答远超龙虾~~~
One day Australians will wake poor, in a country with an economy nothing more than a hole in the ground and facile 'services'. Australia will end up being like some failed African state because we are a naive country, lacking the necessary self interest to survive in this world. Our future will be as second class citizens in our own country, where everything will be owned by overseas interests, all the best food will go overseas and the lucky Australians will get jobs as airport greeters for wealthy tourists.
Douglas - December 08, 2010, 7:38AM
有一天澳大利亚人会懊恼的发现整个国家的经济只剩地上的洞和简单的“服务业”。我们的国家如此幼稚如此缺乏在这个世界生存所必须自我追求，所以最后我们会跟非洲的那些失败国家一样。将来在我们的国家里我们都是二等公民，而国家的一切都在外国人手中，最好的食品会被运往海外，幸运的澳大利亚人只会得到在机场接富有的外国游客的迎宾工作。
SteveH.
This one seems straight out of the 70s. Most academics have moved beyond this kind of terminology to define China. It has undergone a significant shift in the post Mao era.
You could also argue the U.S. hegemony is a true threat and that our dealings with them is of great concern. Look at Julia Gillard's reaction to the Julian Assange case- what happened to the values that are meant to underpin Western society?
PromRB | Terrigal - December 08, 2010, 8:37AM
Steven H
这人像是70 年代来的。大多数学者已经不用这类术语定义中国了，毛时代之后中国已经历重大转变。
你该质疑美国的霸权，这才是真正能够威胁我们的，我们还要关注对美国的措施。看看Julia Gillard' （澳大利亚总理）对朱利安阿桑奇案的处理——构成西方社会基石的价值观现在成什么样子了？
What a strange democracy, here we have a man who lied and deceived and free to to con us more.
In a meantime we have WIKILEAKS founder Julian Assange who is exposing the truth about how our sneaky our leaders are and is arrested with more lies.
Innocent before being guilty ??????
Rick | Sydney - December 08, 2010, 8:56AM
真是奇怪的民主啊，我们中间有人撒谎了。
同时维基泄密的创始人阿桑奇揭露了我们的领导人我们的黑箱交易，然后他就因为谎言被捕了。判定有罪之前不是无罪的嘛？？？
what a lot of tripe... China's political ideology is not even remotely close to ours... they're a business partner plain and simple but definitely not a friend... what should be borne in mind too is their own domestic situation forced repatriation of millions of people and the free thinking next generation may not be as stable as first thought.
Dino | Melbourne - December 08, 2010, 9:00AM
好多废话~~ 中国的政治形态和我们从不接近~~ 他们是好的生意伙伴，直接又简单，但不会是朋友~~ 需要牢记的事实是他们国内的形式使得数百万人被遣返回国，还有他们习惯自由思考的下一代不会比上一代更加稳定好管。
At last some sane analysis and commentary on China. For all this talk about power and 'deploying force' I cannot recall China invading, occupying and destroying any countries of late, let alone causing untold death, suffering and destruction. Were the horrific yet wholly pointless American adventures in Vietnam and Iraq evidence of a good international citizen?
Let's hope when China leads the world it uses its power and prosperity more constructively and usefully for the good and well-being of people.
War does not seem to help very much with anything and war-mongering rhetoric that some of our politicians like to indulge is just pathetic.
SwampFire - December 08, 2010, 9:06AM
最后有一些关于中国的理智的分析和评论，文中谈到的了权利和“派遣军队”，可我完全不知道最近中国做过什么侵略，占领，毁灭之类的事，更别说是中国造成的无数的死亡，磨难和大破坏了。难道美国在伊拉克和越南可怕而无谓冒险能说明美国是国际好公民？
让我们希望但中国领导世界的时候，她能建设性的利用他的实力和繁荣以造福有良好意愿的好人。
我们没有能力做什么事，政客们却沉湎于战争扩散论，这真是悲剧。
I think the Chinese are dangerous and would turn on us if it suited them without blinking an eye.
John | Sydney - December 08, 2010, 9:17AM
我觉得中国人很危险，只要他们觉得适合他们就会蹂躏我们，连眼都不会眨一眨。
As an Australian citizen I demand real leadership!!!! GET OUT-- GILLARD-RUDD-SWAN!!!
zac48 | Melb. - December 08, 2010, 9:37AM
做为澳大利亚公民，我要个真正的领导！！GILLARD （澳大利亚总理）- 陆克文- 天鹅滚出去!
For all who still are not sure how life would be when China dominates, check out how China treats her colonies, occupied terrritory throughout history. Any foreign domination on a country is not a good thing, despite all its negativity, I prefer American influence than Chinese.
HistoryDoesNotLie
- December 08, 2010, 9:57AM
那些不知道中国接管（澳洲）后自己会怎么样的人好好翻翻中国历史，看看中国是怎么对待他侵占的领土和殖民地人民的。外国统治对一个国家来说不是好事，即使有种种负面影响。我还是宁可选择美国（来接管我们）。
The Kevin Rudd/Julia Gillard ascendency has made us an utter laughing stock on the world stage.
A pity we don't have an adult like John Howard back running the country, and the likes of Alexander Downer and Peter Costello presenting an able of capable face to the world.
All we have with the ALP is a bunch of bumblers solely interested in power for its own sake.
As for dopey Kevin Rudd, he is the Labor gift that keeps on giving to the Coalition.
Frank Chamberlain
| Canberra On The Line - December 08, 2010, 10:03AM
凯文陆克文和茱莉亚吉拉德让我们成为了世界舞台上的大笑话。
很遗憾我们没有一个像约翰霍华德那样的人来执掌国家也没有亚历山大唐纳 （前澳大利亚外长）和 彼得霍华德科斯特洛（前澳大利亚财长）那样的人领导我们面对世界。
澳大利亚工党带给我们的只有一群专注于自己权利的酒囊饭袋。
还有迟钝的陆克文，他就是一个工党送给联合政府/ 联合体的大礼包。
In my short lifetime, I have seen the extreme idealogy of the followers of Chairman Mao, take China back 500 years, culturally and economically, in 3 years of murderous, extremist rampage, that saw most of Chinas academics butchered, or sent to till fields.
The same followers of the same idealogy still run China, and there is no reason why the same events, that produced the Cultural Revolution of 1968, couldn't happen again - very quickly.
The Chinese are the shrewdest business operators on the face of the planet. They are getting rid of their massive U.S. dollars stockpile by exchanging them for hard assets, such as mines and energy sources - while the U.S. dollar is still worth something. They will end up controlling everything from their raw supplies to manufacturing, a la Henry Ford.
It's then we will have to watch out, as they squeeze our family jewels, with price increases and total control of manufactured supplies - and possibly even food.
They also quite devious when it comes to achieving their aims. Witness the stunt they pulled in the early 1970's, when they knew their very large, planned wool order, would affect the depressed wool market.
They quietly bought vast amounts of wool futures at low prices, then placed their wool order - and the wool price skyrocketed.
They sold off their wool futures at such a vast profit, the money they made, paid for all the Australian wheat they imported that year. We trust China implicitly at our peril.
Ron N
| Perth, W.A. - December 08, 2010, 10:14AM
在我短短的一生中我见识过毛泽东追随者的极端意识形态，这种意识形态3 年的肆虐就让中国的经济文化倒退了500 年，中国大多数学者被横行的极端主义残害，或者离开自己的研究领域。
现在执掌中国的还是这种意识形态的追随者，所以没有理由认为促成1968 年文革的事件不会再发生——也许很快就会。
中国人是世界上最精明的生意人，他们用美元购买矿山能源之类的实体资产来消耗美元储备——当然是在美元还值些钱的时候。以后他们将会控制一切，从原材料，制造业到福特公司。
我们还在观望，他们终会以商品价格上涨和控制工业产品供应来压榨我们的财富——说不定他们连食品都会控制。他们在如何达成目的方面手段老练，看看在 1970 年代他们得知巨量有计划的羊毛订单可以影响低迷的羊毛市场时，他们推出的惊人一幕。他们以低价悄悄地买下大量羊毛期货，然后拿出他们的羊毛订单——羊毛价格一下就冲上了天。他们再卖掉羊毛期货，获取大量利润，用这笔钱支付当年从澳大利亚进口小麦的货款。我们相信我们的巨大危险在于中国。
I always thought Rudd was arrogant, the latest revelations are to my mind foolhardy and damaging, so when is it time for him to be replaced? He just does not have the skill or demeanor to be an effective foreign minister, that should be plan enough, even for the most one-eyed labour party hack....ok, forgive me , I live in hope.
RB
| Melbourne - December 08, 2010, 10:23AM
我一直认为陆克文傲慢无知，现在的证据让我觉得他还莽撞和坏事，那么他什么时候下台呢？就连做外长他都显得缺乏技巧和风度，那本该是她能得到的最高职位，即使对独眼的工党来说~~ 原谅我，我生活在希望中。
Let me ask you a very simple question. Mr Rudd, are we going to send our troop to Taiwan if China uses force to reunite Taiwan? I ask you another question, if two siblings live in the other end of the street has disputes, on what ground you want to intervene? China is not Afghanistan. Our cities could be destroyed by nuclear weapon attacks if we are involved unnecessary.
Sammy
- December 08, 2010, 10:28AM
我问个简单的问题。陆克文先生如果中国强行统一台湾，我们是不是要派部队过去？换个问题，如果两个住在街那头的兄弟吵起来了你打算以什么理由介入？中国不是阿富汗。如果我们无端介入，我们的城市就会挨核弹。
I think its great australian politicians speak there mind...do u want oz to keep going to senseless wars with the US because not going might offend them...GROW UP AUSTRALIA! Just because we have a history of being freightened by the big wide world doesnt mean its a rational fear...STOP BEING SCARED OF THE WORLD, we are all big boys and girls!!! Australias national interest far outways possibly offending another country...thought that would have been common sense!
Rob
| ACT - December 08, 2010, 10:52AM
我觉得澳洲政客说出他们的想法没什么不好，难道我们介入无聊的战争仅仅因为不这样做就可能得罪美国~~ 澳大利亚成熟点吧！我们有畏惧世界大佬的历史并不能成为这种畏惧就是合理的证据~~ 不要再被这个世界吓着了，我们都是大人了！！！澳大利亚的国家利益远高于可能得罪美国的顾虑~~ 这应该是常识吧！
SteveH,
Interestingly enough that is just what the Capitalist Russia did under the tutelage of the US when Russia emerged from the Soviet period. Indeed the Russian Oligarchs are known around the world as the most rapacious kleptocracy on the face of the planet. That also was theft, on a grand scale!
lesm
| Balmain - December 08, 2010, 10:56AM
SteveH,
有趣的是当俄罗斯从苏联脱离出来时庇护他的就是美国，俄罗斯的寡头却是以地球上最贪婪的盗贼闻名于世。俄罗斯确实以极大的规模被偷了。
China and India are the biggest threats to region and the world in this new century. Embolden by the outsourcing of western jobs to these countries (profits going straight to their respective leadership), they have started to exude an aura of entitlement.
These nations have been gifted, rather than earned their power (by stupid western governments who arranged the one way trade system against the best interests of the west)
Australia still has a chance to hold its own, and remain a relevant independent nation, As SE asia is doing now (resistance to Chinese Hegemony by Vietnam, Korea, Japan, Indonesia.)
We need real leaders looking out for Australia.
Unfortunatley,
Tempest | Melbourne - December 08, 2010, 11:46AM
中国和印度是21 世纪最大的两个地区和世界威胁，西方国家给他们的外包工作（工作的获利都在领导人手里）更促进了他们的权利开始发出光芒。
这两个国家都很有天赋权利的意味而不是赚取权利（就是那些制定单向贸易法则的愚蠢政客妨害了西方的利益，赋予中印权利）
澳大利亚还有机会把握自己，保持相对独立，就像现在的东盟（越南，韩国，日本，印尼一起抵抗中国霸权）
我们需要找到真正的领袖。 可是太不幸了。
John, you need to be very clear in what you say.
Your claim thatChina is not a threat needs to be backed by facts. Please tell the readership what exactly China need nuclear weapons if they are not a threat? Also Please discuss why China need Aircraft carriers if they are not a threat? Aircraft carriers sole function is to enable fighter planes to become an offensive weapon. Also John, can you discuss what a peacful China needs enormous navies and is claiming ownership of the yellow sea?
It seems John Garnaut is making statements as to position Australia as some kind of lackey in a world where he perceives China as the sole superpower.
Tempest
| Melbourne - December 08, 2010, 12:00PM
John （本文作者），你需要澄清你所说的。
你说中国不是威胁，这需要事实支持。请你告诉读者如果中国不是威胁为什么中国需要核武器？也请你说说如果中国不是威胁为什么中国需要航空母舰？航空母舰唯一的作用就是将舰载机转化为攻击性武器。还有，请你说说为什么爱好和平的中国需要大量海军，还宣告了黄海的主权？
John 的陈述让澳大利亚看上去像是中国的奴仆，在Jonh 的世界里中国是唯一的超级大国。
TBC
狗仔卡
发表于 2010-12-18 11:35
提升卡
变色卡
抢沙发
千斤顶
显身卡
感谢LZ辛苦翻译，不错啊~
